[18:04] Tenaar Feiri: && I think that going for something Tolkienesque might actually be a pretty smart move.
[18:04] Tenaar Feiri: Lord of the Rings is still popular.
[18:04] Ashtyn Ninetails: Hold on Caex, don't destroy the place yet.
[18:05] Tenaar Feiri: Still an attractive subject.
[18:05] Caex Silverfall: i asked if you wanted me to sift through files XP
[18:05] Ani Aunerfal: That may be something we should collectively create an event for caex, not just something for one of us to work on
[18:05] Caex Silverfall: i have seven documents per folder
[18:05] Ashtyn Ninetails: I think he's just excited about the idea of destroying the place.
[18:05] Felix Stourmead: hehe Avatar is making ashtyn seize up
[18:06] Tenaar Feiri: River was working on something called project 'Penance' as part of a storyline (intended as a failed project btw), which was a ley-line destabilizer. What if she were to complete it, but it got sabotaged & went off here?
[18:06] Caex Silverfall: each document details the destruction of the sim's core areas forcing a rebuild. they're what i cal lD Day events
[18:06] Tenaar Feiri: A ley-line destabilizer would likely tear a huge rift through the island
[18:06] Tenaar Feiri is apocalyptic!
[18:06] Ani Aunerfal: Too character centric. It needs to involve as many of our current plots as possible
[18:06] Ashtyn Ninetails: Hold on, guys, we're not blowing everything up yet! Let's first agree on the idea! And there's something huge I said that, which I want to hear about: The city and the Zenko merge!
[18:06] Ani Aunerfal: Because it's going to effect them all
[18:07] Caex Silverfall: i've been stating that's a good idea for ages ash XP
[18:07] Ashtyn Ninetails: Ok.
[18:07] Caex Silverfall: but it needs to be done right, there needs to be motive
[18:07] Tenaar Feiri: I'm just saying, there are a lot of ways to destroy stuff! && I've gone in depth about the city & zenko merge already
[18:07] Caex Silverfall: also, it would have to arise through a new leader, lucian isn't likely to cause it to happen, no offence ani
[18:07] Tenaar Feiri: So I just say yes to it :3
[18:07] Felix Stourmead: well im not so sure about having a huge wall but im not opposed to the idea as long as the city doesnt try to take over the zenko *eyes a certain fen fen!*
[18:08] Ashtyn Ninetails: And Ani is right, whatever we do shouldn't be the result of one character's actions starting it. It needs to be bigger.
[18:08] Tenaar Feiri: METEOR STRIKE!
[18:08] Tenaar Feiri:
[18:08] Xela Soulstar: since we seem to have lost the order... I like the idea of having a wall around the city, seperating it from hostile lands. Its something I've always loved the concept of (and a large part of Xela's past, as it happens...). As long as Phoenix gets a wall, or maybe even giant gates (like dwarfen gates leading into the caves), then I'll be happy
[18:08] Caex Silverfall: hence why at least 5 files in each folder are listed as "natural disaster" type events
[18:09] Xela Soulstar: and gives ECs more opportunity for random monster attacks
[18:09] Felix Stourmead: but wouldnt a wall restrict movement from the city to the temple?
[18:09] Xela Soulstar: "Oh? you are outside the walls? RAWR!"
[18:09] Caex Silverfall: not realy, more focuses you along patsh
[18:09] Ani Aunerfal: Let's save planning the destruction for if we decide to do that, and involve everyone with it when it's time, for now let's talk about other stuff
[18:09] Caex Silverfall: each wall needs a gatehouse
[18:10] Caex Silverfall: it would be no diffrent than having people go to the stairs to get into the city as it currently stands.
[18:10] Ashtyn Ninetails: Well, that's the catch: The Temple as it is has exhausted its essence. I know many of you here have Temple characters, but let's ask the one I consider the foremost character at the Temple, simply because of her relentless presence there: Bamika....
[18:10] Felix Stourmead: i suppose but we would have to put a gate or open walled path
[18:10] Xela Soulstar: Its holy, should be protected from monsters that way
[18:11] Ashtyn Ninetails: The Temple needs a new renaissance. It's no longer sustainable the way it is/was without Glasere and Ursa.
[18:11] Ani Aunerfal grunts..
[18:11] Bamika Easterman: There's no roleplay there. I've been going up to the city
[18:12] Caex Silverfall: either way we need more people. hopefully we can make changes for the better. look at it as a way to recruit people to the temple ani, not as us destroying your home
[18:12] Maxwell Mohr is Offline
[18:12] Bamika Easterman: Precious little even in the city
[18:13] Caex Silverfall: we need a resurection, an influx
[18:13] Felix Stourmead: I think we should at least consider new leadership of the temple maybes
[18:13] Felix Stourmead: I wouldnt want to get rid of it :|
[18:13] Caex Silverfall: why is ashes avitar having an epoleptic seasure?
[18:14] Felix Stourmead: because of Avatar
[18:14] Tenaar Feiri: I'm sitting on him.
[18:14] Felix Stourmead: XD
[18:14] Tenaar Feiri: My energy gives all the people epileptic seizures.
[18:14] Ani Aunerfal: I /have/ been leading it and bringing new members in
[18:14] Ashtyn Ninetails: Ani, I love you, and I deeply respect your opinions and ideas. And you are an incredibly good RPer. But you stretch yourself too thin. You have characters in roles you love in pretty much every corner of the sim. That too isn't sustainable. It works for having someone in place for events, but long-term it isn't good for you, or for the sim. You alone can't populate Lismore. Out of respect for you and Bamika I have stayed completely out of Temple issues all this time but I think it no longer can work the way it is. We need to tear it down and re-build it in a more centralized area.
[18:14] Caex Silverfall: if only sl allowed me to save video, this is halarous
[18:15] Felix Stourmead: I dont think we need to tear down the temple o.o'
[18:15] Ashtyn Ninetails: Everything in there was put in place by Glasere, who isn't around to maintain it. We can't have that.
[18:15] Felix Stourmead: you mean rebuild the temple not removing it?
[18:15] Xela Soulstar: I think we should rebuild it, but for the most part I think the temple is fine
[18:15] Tenaar Feiri: As much as I enjoy Temple RP, I do agree with Ash' that it needs a complete redo.
[18:16] Xela Soulstar: maybe it could be built -in- the tree of life?
[18:16] Bamika Easterman: People are more important than things
[18:16] Xela Soulstar: like, the biggest treehouse. ever.
[18:16] Ashtyn Ninetails: I'm not saying get rid of the Temple. I'm saying it needs to be re-done.
[18:16] Felix Stourmead: oks id be cool with it
[18:16] Xela Soulstar: like ash's treehouse home
[18:16] Ashtyn Ninetails: If not for the sake of RP, for technical reasons, it needs to be re-done, because I can't maintain the stuff Glasere or Ursa have put there.
[18:17] Caex Silverfall: i think if the temple built it into the tree of life, that would be epic. ash can already build massive trees that look damn cool. and i'm sure the fox can think of some great ways to make a holy temple out of a tree
[18:17] Bamika Easterman: The grandest temple in the world is no fun with no people in it
[18:17] Ashtyn Ninetails: So since we are going to be digging at its foundations, I also think we can integrate it with the new centralized center for RP: The City-Zenko-Temple conglomerate.
[18:18] Ani Aunerfal: I'm okay rebuilding the structure if it's neccesary, but the faction itself doesn't need to be messed with
[18:18] Caex Silverfall: ani, i have a question. what would you define as the core concept of the temple
[18:18] Ashtyn Ninetails: The faction can continue, by all means, yes!
[18:18] Xela Soulstar: I agree with Ani there, keep the temple seprate from the city/zenko
[18:18] Xela Soulstar: Zenko and the temple have never got along
[18:18] Xela Soulstar: opposing ideals
[18:18] Bamika Easterman: I say bring them all together
[18:19] Caex Silverfall: one rule ! one purpose! PEACE THROUGH DEER!
[18:19] Felix Stourmead: actually we get along better now
[18:19] Tenaar Feiri: I would think that placing the Temple in a rebuilt fashion in the new city would provide a lot of new and interesting RP opportunities.
[18:19] Ashtyn Ninetails: You need to see the bigger picture: Yes they don't get along. That's EXCELLENT! It creates IC drama which is what keeps the RP going.
[18:19] Tenaar Feiri: Like, for instance, preaching opportunities.
[18:19] Xela Soulstar: Rune already does that >.>
[18:19] Tenaar Feiri: And conversion.
[18:19] Tenaar Feiri: theological
[18:19] Felix Stourmead: Theres a division in labor and specialization for a reason Bam X3
[18:20] Ani Aunerfal: The temple is a neutral faction that pays it's homeage to what they consider the goddess of life and love. They're interest is in spreading that message to it's guests and generally staying out of the fighting and conflicts that involve the other factions, except for cases where it lines up with their beliefs. If you combine the temple with the city and zenko, you might as well just replace the faction, because it won't be the tirrenelda' tribe anymore
[18:20] Caex Silverfall: anyone know how to record video in sl? i have to record ash XP it's just too much
[18:21] Felix Stourmead: I agree with Ani on this one
[18:21] Ani Aunerfal: The reason the zenko and city don't always get along with the temple is because there /are/ essential differences in their values
[18:21] Ashtyn Ninetails: The Tirrenelda' Tribe can exist just as well behind city walls as it can inside an island or in the Wilds or anywhere you throw them into for their protection.
[18:21] Xela Soulstar: I agree with Ani, too
[18:21] Ani Aunerfal: I disagree.
[18:21] Xela Soulstar: the whole style screams, "one with nature"
[18:21] Wolf601 Resident: I don't think that cramming all the factions into one tight corner is going to be healthy for the RP. At all. They should be allowed to bloom into their own identity without being forced to mesh with other factions. You wouldn't see Romanians becoming a single country with Ukraine.
[18:21] Xela Soulstar: being behind a wall near a city kinda breaks it
[18:22] Ashtyn Ninetails: Understand, it gives the tribe something to strive for!
[18:22] Felix Stourmead: yeah I cant see merging into a centralized structure as being a good thing :\
[18:22] Xela Soulstar: Same reason I wish to keep Phoenix independent. Not so much for my ego, but also because it kinda goes against the nature of the faction and how Xela is trying to run it
[18:22] Ashtyn Ninetails: Wolf, respectfully, that's what we've been doing all this time, and we wouldn't be here discussing changes if it were working.
[18:22] Wolf601 Resident: What would they be striving to do? They are a tribe, in the face of a much larger force(the city and Zenko) they'd in time just be assimilated into the city and lost.
[18:23] Bamika Easterman: I think we can have our own identity in any location, based on our faith and values. But as it stands we face non existance through no one to talk to. Silence.
[18:23] Ani Aunerfal: .. And to that, like I said - i've been working on bringing more people in. That will take time, however, no matter where you put the temple
[18:23] Ashtyn Ninetails: Do you see Catholics being assimilated by Wiccans?
[18:24] Caex Silverfall: yes actualy
[18:24] Xela Soulstar: the temple does seem to be picking up slightly lately
[18:24] Caex Silverfall: but that's getting into history and assemalation over many many decades
[18:24] Ashtyn Ninetails: Ok bad example. Make it the other way around: Wiccans assimilated by Catholics.
[18:24] Wolf601 Resident: I see atheists being assimilated by catholics(children indoctrinated at birth)
[18:25] Ani Aunerfal: This is the problem though
[18:26] Tenaar Feiri: The Temple can create their own little sanctuary within the city as well, a neutral paradise. It works the same way as churches; inside them, you're untouchable. They'd still be able to retain their values and spread them more easily to people that need it, as opposed to people who want it. I understand not wanting to change it, but you need to look at it from a view of what RP it could create instead of predicting the doom of the faction. I mean, obviously we're not going to force anything or decide something just yet, but you need to consider what's healthy above what's favorable.
[18:26] Tenaar Feiri: At least, that is my opinion.
[18:26] Ani Aunerfal: If you bring the tirrenelda' tribe into the city and have them live there in the longterm - bare in mind, that the tribe IS the people who live in the temple - the point in the temple faction is lost. A tribe isn't much of a tribe if it's living in the city. They'd just be further citizens of it.
[18:27] Ashtyn Ninetails: No more than they are already citizens of the same island where the city and the Zenko and all those others people are. Just the space will become smaller.
[18:27] Tenaar Feiri: @Wolf: We've been trying to keep the different factions apart for a while now, like Ash' said, but it hasn't worked out as well as we hoped. We'd like to try something different, see if it helps.
[18:28] Ashtyn Ninetails: Is it that much of a difference to have a pretty temple garden 200 meters from here than having it 50 meters from here?
[18:28] Bamika Easterman: The tribe have migrated once before
[18:28] Bamika Easterman: To escape
[18:28] Caex Silverfall: can anyone else see ash's avitar wigging the fuck out? or is it just me?
[18:28] Felix Stourmead: yeah kinda, as the temple tribe kinda likes living in their own neck of the island
[18:28] Felix Stourmead: i can!
[18:28] Tenaar Feiri: I'm enjoying watching it, Caex =P
[18:29] Ani Aunerfal: Yes, because the temple is out in the forest that it was grown out of. It very much is a difference if it's moved into the city.
[18:29] Caex Silverfall: transplanting trees?
[18:29] Ashtyn Ninetails: I'm not saying put the Temple in a paved court in the middle of the city houses, no, it would have its own space, just like any distinct religious sect throughout history, it would segregate itself within the safety of the walls.
[18:29] Caex Silverfall: safety from what though
[18:30] Tenaar Feiri: Like a Cathedral, which was basically a small town within a city more often than not!
[18:30] Caex Silverfall: that's a question we need to answer
[18:30] Ani Aunerfal: That's the problem though, inside the walls
[18:30] Wolf601 Resident: I don't know any better but I can see tribe members not liking that, that they'd feel disconnected from whatever their belief is.
[18:30] Bamika Easterman: We will keep on speaking Her name: some things change some stay the same
[18:30] Ashtyn Ninetails: Zenko, as military force, would have their barracks and fortifications that separate them from everyday life in the city...
[18:30] Caex Silverfall: why would the change be important for the temple, what would drive it? what would cause it? what d anger would arive that is not there now
[18:31] Bamika Easterman: The temple has no defenses left
[18:31] Ani Aunerfal: .. Yes it does.
[18:31] Wolf601 Resident: What would attack the temple in the first place.
[18:31] Felix Stourmead: actually we have our scouts ^^
[18:31] Caex Silverfall: *waves hand* oh hi
[18:31] Wolf601 Resident: If not for a natural event and it being a sentient attacker, what would motivate something to attack a temple of pacifists.
[18:32] Bamika Easterman: The face hates us
[18:32] Tenaar Feiri: Aside from the strategical value of conquering a well-supplied temple full of healers?
[18:32] Caex Silverfall: the face hates everyone XP
[18:32] Tenaar Feiri: Some people just want to see the world burn!
[18:32] Ani Aunerfal: The desert forces would attack the temple, their whole objective is to get at the tree of life in the center.. But the temple is protected by forces contrary to the ones that fuel the desert's forces, and in past events, and i'm sure in the future - if the temple were attacked, would the zenko and city not come to help as they've done in the past?
[18:33] Xela Soulstar: Phoenix would lend its aid, if it can muster the forces
[18:33] Felix Stourmead: we would help no doubt
[18:33] Caex Silverfall: the current zenko's main objective is to prevent the face from obtaining the tree, because if that happens, it turns into a tree of death, and bad shit happens arund trees of death
[18:33] Felix Stourmead: yeah Relina is not about to let anything happen like what happened to her home
[18:35] Ashtyn Ninetails: Ok. We're just going to argue this from the heart until we all turn green, so, let's stop here for a moment.
[18:35] Felix Stourmead: oks
[18:35] Wolf601 Resident: I'm already green.
[18:35] Caex Silverfall: im not trying to argue
[18:35] Caex Silverfall: i'm asking a question, one i actualy want answers so we can move forwards, what would the change be that prompts all of this
[18:36] Caex Silverfall: saying it happens is pointless without understanding the actual cause
[18:36] Xela Soulstar: I dont think the How is important right now.. are we not working out what needs changing?
[18:37] Caex Silverfall: things change for a reason, things adapt because of the changes in an enviorment. if the temple were to move, and this is possibly ani's best defence at this point, why would it move? what would be the point? what would be so dangerous that their standard defence is no longer a valid one?
[18:38] Bamika Easterman: Giant bugs
[18:38] Bamika Easterman: Giant acid bugs
[18:38] Ashtyn Ninetails: Ani, Felix, I value your opinions, but I'm gonna side with Bamika on this. The Temple is dead as it is, it NEEDS to be resurrected and that won't happen with the current setup we have. We are flatlined and stagnant and need to improve, and I believe that for us to improve, we must bring players closer together, we must cut down on the number of factions spread across the sim and put them together under one nation.
[18:38] Caex Silverfall: yes it needs a paint job, but i doubt termi... well no termites may cause a move
[18:38] Ani Aunerfal: The temple's scouts and characters can fight desert forces. They're far from defenseless
[18:38] Ashtyn Ninetails: Objectively there's no good reason the temple would not move behind the city walls. It's strategically smart, and they can still maintain their neutrality by trading their professional services for it to the city.
[18:38] Ani Aunerfal: Except for all the stuff i was talking about up there..
[18:39] Ashtyn Ninetails: I acknowledge the stuff you said, but I respectfully disagree, Ani.
[18:39] Ani Aunerfal: Because if they do that, what they're basically going to be saying is "Well, forget about all of our religious values, let's just move into the city because it's safer."
[18:40] Felix Stourmead: well also if you move the temple, your going to have to move the tree
[18:40] Caex Silverfall: we can tell ash, youre shaking your head going nononononono nope, nope, nope, not gonna happen, nope. nuhuhh... nope, nada, ziltch, NOOOOOO
[18:40] Ashtyn Ninetails: Ani the Temple can build their garden paradise in there!
