Author Topic: The Future of The Lismore RP Tool!  (Read 7663 times)

Tenaar Feiri

  • Global Moderator
  • Super Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1107
    • View Profile
The Future of The Lismore RP Tool!
« on: July 07, 2014, 10:00:12 am »
Hey people! It's time for one of these threads again!

Don't freak out! The RP tool's existence is not in jeopardy, we're going to keep working on it for as long as we possibly can! It's a labour of love, and we're not about to put it down or anything. What's happening here is that the number of people using the RP tool is growing quickly, sometimes by as much as a few dozen unique accounts a day, and as of the time I type this, there are 2,861 unique accounts out there who have at some point tried, used, and/or are still using the Lismore RP Tool. That's insane, and we'd never expected the tool to become this popular! But now that it is, it's opening up new opportunities for where we can take the tool. And also new caveats.

First, let me tell you a little about the current RP Tool that's in use today. It was created in response to an earlier RP tool that we used in Lismore which was no longer being developed, and so Erika, Xela & I started putting our heads together to create something that was meant to replace that very outdated tool. And from that, the first iteration of the Lismore RP Tool emerged. I'll be honest, it was BAD, and buggy as Hell, and as it was being tested & developed, we could at worst release both 3 or 4 updates for it a day! It felt kind of like how I'd imagine it'd feel working at Microsoft trying to fix the inherently broken Vista OS. Only, y'know, we actually fixed the tool & made it better, as opposed to Microsoft who kind of just mucked about & ate s***!
It was always our goal to make a good RP tool for the players of Lismore, so at first the features were being designed specifically for that purpose. In hindsight, perhaps the tool should have been coded with a bit more flexibility in mind, but I'll get to that eventually.
As the tool neared its official release in Lismore, we finally managed to implement a good HUD design and the much requested server backup feature, two things we have had especially great feedback on! Thanks, you guys; you're awesome!

Then after release, we were surprised to learn that it wasn't just Lismorians who were using the tool anymore; we were getting feedback from players from other sims, and even from RP admins interested in making the RP tool their standard! Which was great, we were very honoured and eager to serve! Since then, we've been expanding the RP tool piece by piece, adding new features and optimizations (and a smaller HUD design!). The fact that the RP Tool now seems to be becoming a widely-used standard in the SL roleplaying community is something we're tremendously proud of, and it has also opened up for the possibilities of evolving the tool & make use of more advanced server infrastructure to enhance the tool's capabilities, and do things that weren't possible before. Ideas that have been thrown around have been an AddOn system, which I've said is in the works many times, but has turned out to be difficult to do with the current codebase. But what an AddOn system would mean for the tool, is that developers of other RP tools would be able to integrate native support for their creations (such as money systems, crafting systems, even combat systems) into the RP tool and offer them as installable modules.
We're looking at a potential equivalent to the Windows App store, or Google Play, where you could be able to upgrade your RP tool's features yourself with modules made specifically to integrate with it. For instance, it could enable a working money system to integrate with your character save files & securely store amounts of currency in them, that is then communicated to a server managing the RP economy for individual sims, effectively allowing the possibility of emulating real-life economy & making the RP world more interactive with both player and NPC merchants. This isn't something that's going to be a default functionality or developed by us, but when that time comes, we'll be able to offer our server to the developer of such a system to build its infrastructure & develop an economy module for the tool.
Another possibility would be a health system, where an active character could be afflicted with, say Polio, and a medical professional treating your character would be able to look up what kind effects it's having on your character, and a guide on how to RP treating it -- possibly for this and that time period, and it could even be affected by that particular medical professional's skill level, and so on. All this could be enabled simply by informing our servers you'd like a module to enable the functionality, and then installing it when you retrieve it.

Standardizing the RP Tool is now something we'd like to do, for there are so many ways in which the tool can assist & enhance the RP experience, as well as providing educational material to those who would like it (such as people RPing medical professionals, but who aren't actually that IRL & would otherwise need to spend ages looking things up for other players' specific cases -- or even questioning that player about the effects if it's a custom condition!), offering ways to manage posting queues -- which is something that has been requested. Another feature we could add, is a concept called "Global LFRP", which is basically turning the existing LFRP system into a "hub" for SL roleplayers to find other RP sims with, and people RPing in them, or find other people RPing in their current sims, complete with friend lists, blacklists, etc. all handled by an external server. Ultimately, expanding the LFRP system in this way, though it would be a daunting task, would help connect roleplayers across sims & help promote a stronger, closer community, especially between sims in the same categories. Players would be allowed to find the genres of sims that they want more easily, without having to trawl the SL search engine, or TP to random RP hubs hoping to find something that they like; expanding the tool in this way would allow them to pick & choose between registered sims of their desired category & easily visit them, hassle-free.
And there's so much more that's possible!

However!
"This looks like it could be the start of an amazing thing," someone might think. Yes, it could be! But there are obstacles we'll need to overcome to do it. First and foremost, the current RP tool that you're using, it has reached its finishing point. I mentioned this earlier in the post; we hadn't anticipate this popularity! The consequence of this is that the current version of the RP tool you all are using, it is too "hardcoded" to be able to attain any of these things we would like to do. We can't add the functionalities we desire without breaking important features in the tool, and because of that, we will be doing some minor bugfixes to the current RP tool, and then we will leave it alone. We don't want to break it.
The solution?
We've started development of a "PRO" version of the RP tool that's much more optimized & upgrade friendly, and it's currently still in developer testing but it's looking very promising. The PRO RP tool interacts with itself in an entirely different way than the current one, and it works faster & already has more features than the current version. More importantly, it's also completely HUD-independent (unless you want modules). As it is right now, you can operate every feature of it by chat command, without a HUD. This is an important step in our new direction: we realize some of you don't like to depend on HUDs for this and that, or just plain have to many of them attached. Well, you don't need the HUD anymore with the PRO version. You won't ever!

But now we encounter a different problem we didn't have before: funding!
Brrh, that's a terrible word! You know you won't like it if something that is currently completely free starts talking about money! Did it just get colder in here?

I've iterated that we want to standardize the RP Tool in the roleplaying community of Second Life, so that it is the go-to tool for all your RP needs, able to either natively cover your every need, or able to attach a module to do the job. We want, if you'll pardon my French, to make it the best damn tool on the grid! But we're just a small team of developers, and we do have shortcomings. We are also ordinary people with ordinary jobs, and not terribly much dough to spare. Maintaining the server for the RP Tool costs money, and building an infrastructure able to do what we want it to do is even more costly, and will take time. So now we're at a little bit of an impasse!

We sincerely need some funding if we're to be able to improve and expand the RP tool, and especially if we end up having to hire more programmers and webdev-heads to accomplish some of that we wish to achieve.

Therefore I wish to ask what your opinions are, as users of the current RP tool! When the PRO version is completed, there are a few ways we can go about releasing it, what kind of model we want for it, etc. The plan right now is to offer it as a paid item on the marketplace in conjunction with the free RP tool, but at the same time I can foresee a lot of frustration emerging from the fact that the free RP tool would basically be in "development stasis", where it's kept alive but no longer being updated -- unless it's extremely important to do so, while the paid version gets all the love. And we would like to continue to offer you a great RP tool for free, but at the same time, we need a more stable source of income to make it even greater!
Oh, and keep in mind that it's still a long time until the PRO RP Tool is even remotely ready for release, so there's seriously no rush! It won't have the features I've discussed here on release most likely, but it's something we'll be gradually adding over time. Even so, the PRO RP Tool has at least 7-8 months left to go before it might be ready for public use. Maybe even more.


So! I've made this poll, which has the 3 ideas we think are the best listed, but if you have other ideas that could work, you're welcome to vote "Other" & comment on the poll. We always appreciate your feedback & ideas, and we take pride in seriously considering everything! Without you, we wouldn't even be here today at this point where we can discuss the future of the RP Tool and where to go from here. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: You guys are awesome!

You can find the poll here: http://vote.pollcode.com/57511779

Please vote, and you're welcome to leave your comments. They will be read! If you're also a Lismore player with an account here, you can use this topic for comments as well.


Happy roleplaying, folks!
« Last Edit: July 07, 2014, 11:54:48 am by Tenaar Feiri »

Novaku

  • Chaos Personified
  • Global Moderator
  • Super Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1064
  • Welcome, to oblivion!
    • View Profile
    • Nova's Youtube Channel
Re: The Future of The Lismore RP Tool!
« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2014, 01:15:27 pm »
Stopped reading after the word "Funding"







No but seriously, it's awesome that the RP tool has gotten so much popularity, from something that was originally intended to just be used for us to turning into something that is used more globally around the SL net. I hope you'll be able to make this Pro version and that it will be another great success.
"We are nothing but pawns in the world, in this  world that is nothing but a game. Our actions, our fates are bound decided by the game, we move because the game commands us to do so. Only the players know what faith will befall us for we signify nothing but strategic movements." Valencia Versthaler

Ookamisuke

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 21
    • View Profile
Re: The Future of The Lismore RP Tool!
« Reply #2 on: July 07, 2014, 01:50:38 pm »
Maybe make the PRO version free, but charge for the other one? Make the other one have the same features as the Pro does at rollout, but from that point forward, make the "old" version the beta-test version. It would save your end time and resources if the public beta-tests the product for you, and you would be charging so that when the public finds a problem, you are getting paid to fix it. If there is no problem, you have money set aside to pay for a future version's issues.

Ausar

  • Super Poster
  • ******
  • Posts: 1009
  • Demon of Plenty
    • View Profile
    • Starfall
Re: The Future of The Lismore RP Tool!
« Reply #3 on: July 07, 2014, 04:45:06 pm »
While I appreciate your enthusiasm, Tenaar, I think for most players the RP tool is just that - a little tool to add some convenience to their game. I don't need it to be the best out there, or the one that every other roleplaying sim uses. The tool doesn't make for better, more eloquent players. Usually doesn't bring in more players, either. And if you want to move away from a free tool it will scare some potential players away for sure.

The modular setup sounds nice, but for me most of the examples given rather take away from the actual roleplay then add to it. There is a reason why a lot of people don't want hard numbers for the economic system: It would turn into real work to portray a certain role. Someone with less free time on his hands couldn't be the rich merchant, because he couldn't grind the system all the time. But true RP always has been about empowering you to play the things you like to play in your own time. I don't have to be a martial artist to feel like one in the arena, don't need a diploma to enact the wise wizard from faraway lands.
 
When I log into Lismore, I want to play with my fellow friends and players. The tool works at it's best when I don't even notice it all that much.
The only way to get rid of temptation is to yield to it.

MysticLancer

  • Global Moderator
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 418
    • View Profile
Re: The Future of The Lismore RP Tool!
« Reply #4 on: July 07, 2014, 05:13:59 pm »
How much money will you need for this project?

Tenaar Feiri

  • Global Moderator
  • Super Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1107
    • View Profile
Re: The Future of The Lismore RP Tool!
« Reply #5 on: July 07, 2014, 05:21:11 pm »
While I appreciate your enthusiasm, Tenaar, I think for most players the RP tool is just that - a little tool to add some convenience to their game. I don't need it to be the best out there, or the one that every other roleplaying sim uses. The tool doesn't make for better, more eloquent players. Usually doesn't bring in more players, either. And if you want to move away from a free tool it will scare some potential players away for sure.

The modular setup sounds nice, but for me most of the examples given rather take away from the actual roleplay then add to it. There is a reason why a lot of people don't want hard numbers for the economic system: It would turn into real work to portray a certain role. Someone with less free time on his hands couldn't be the rich merchant, because he couldn't grind the system all the time. But true RP always has been about empowering you to play the things you like to play in your own time. I don't have to be a martial artist to feel like one in the arena, don't need a diploma to enact the wise wizard from faraway lands.
 
When I log into Lismore, I want to play with my fellow friends and players. The tool works at it's best when I don't even notice it all that much.

But that is also why it's modular; none of that functionality would be standard, and the examples are just that: examples! They're things that I personally think would be pretty sweet, but there are a bunch of developers out there far more creative than I am, & they'll probably create features for the tool that could blow the mind. The module system is planned to be precisely what you want: a way to empower players to play the way they like in their own time. Just because I couldn't think up better examples, doesn't mean there won't be any. If you don't want to play a certain way, you just don't install the module. The beauty of the future tool is that everything but the standard functionality will be completely optional!

It's not at all the goal to use the tool to make better, more eloquent roleplayers either, or bring in players to and from specific sims (although the future LFRP upgrade will definitely help new RPers find sims to RP in quicker than the standard SL search -- which isn't really much of an achievement to begin with, considering how crap that search is). The goal is to standardize RP in Second Life, so that everyone can choose to do everything they want without having to jump through hoops and fire to get what they need for it; if you want to just use the tool as is, that's fine. If you want, say a pet system someone made for it, you click a button on a website & the server delivers the module, then it attaches itself to your tool when you rez them together; If you suddenly don't want the pet system, just rez the tool on the ground & hit a button and it uninstalls itself without a hassle. If you want to be Godfrey The Giant Slayer with a thousand super-OP modules that make you the most invincible character, well we won't recommend it... but you could do that.


I want to clarify something though: We'll never move away from having a free tool; in one form or another, there will always be a free tool, whether 100% free with a paid commercial version on the side, or 75% free where you get all the new functionality, but some server-specific features need to be unlocked with a subscription. Either way, there will be a free tool, with all the functionality needed to RP.
We're never going to fully commercialize it, but we have to be realistic: the RP Tool is being used, and it's using server capacity. And the more people that use it, the more features we can implement & the more optimized we can make it. But it's also more work, & needs a bigger team. We have to pay for the server, and potentially a bigger team, one way or another.


How much money will you need for this project?

I'd imagine quite a bit, but we'll have actual numbers when the time nears. Prices won't be unreasonable though; it's already decided that if we go with the new PRO version of the tool, that it's not going to cost more than L$700 to purchase. It's probably going to be much less. I'd imagine the other solution, of making the new version just a free upgrade to the current tool w/ subscription for server services, could be between L$20 & L$80 a month. With the amount of people we have actively using the backups today, we'd be looking at a monthly income of almost L$30,000 if half of them subscribed, which is actually more than enough to cover the server costs alone right now.

These are all just guesstimated figures, but the point is that it's not going to cost you an arm & a leg.

TheGreatBeatrix

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 7
    • View Profile
Re: The Future of The Lismore RP Tool!
« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2014, 03:16:31 am »
People use it because it's free and convenient. Attempting to expand on it to this level makes it no longer that. This doesn't appear to have anything to do with the current RP tool and seems like it could be a completely independent side-project that just uses the same code.

Making parts of it cost money would simply keep most people from getting that part of it, rendering any feature that requires a lot of people to be on the same page completely useless. Titlers and 'RP enhancing' things that you have to 'buy' sell like a clockwork turd. You'd be better off working on your idea internally and pitching sales of personalized versions on commission to sim owners for use in their sim.

-Bea

Tenaar Feiri

  • Global Moderator
  • Super Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 1107
    • View Profile
Re: The Future of The Lismore RP Tool!
« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2014, 03:24:00 am »
Thank you very much for all your comments so far!

I've gotten a lot of feedback both here and in-game from other users of the RP tool, and it's really quite astonishing to see the level of engagement in the tool's development. I never quite expected that, and I greatly appreciate all of the responses.

We at Neckbeards Anonymous pride ourselves in being able to offer solid role-playing utilities, but we cannot do that if we don't take your feedback seriously. While the response has been largely positive, a majority of users have expressed very valid concerns about restricting certain features to subscription-based models, as well as offering the tool up on sale for a one-time fee. Therefore, after much deliberation, it's been decided that the current model is going to continue as it always has!

So what does this mean for you?

Simple: You get the RP tool, and all of its online and 'offline' features, completely free of charge, no strings!

Current users of the RP tool will all receive the new Neckbeard RP Tool Pro through the normal update system once released, free of charge. When the NRPTP (Neckbeard RP Tool Pro) is released, the current "Lismore RP Tool" will be considered deprecated, and its server connection will continue to operate for 365 days (1 year) after NRPTP's release. Once that year has passed, character backups & other online functions for the "Lismore RP Tool" will be disabled so to focus server performance on NRPTP.

The transition from the LRPT (Lismore RP Tool) to NRPTP should be as smooth as possible; NRPTP works almost exactly the same as LRPT, save a few optimizations here and there such as that "/1 color" will be able to recognize if you're entering a preset or a RGB value, meaning that "/1 colorrgb" no longer exists, etc.), but I believe a year of continued LRPT support after release should be more than enough to get used to the new tool!


Q&A:

Q: What about character backups? Will I be able to carry them over to the new tool?
A: Most likely not. Part of the reason the NRPTP has come into existence is that the LRPT was not originally designed for mass-consumption. It was designed purely with Lismore in mind, and was customized as such. As a result, many things about the RP tool weren't mutable enough to provide smooth transitions between updates, & maintaining it so that it keeps its appeal to users from other sims was basically a nightmare. The syntax for character backups was unfortunately one of those things that were too rigid to update, and trying to do so kept breaking the character loading feature, the save feature, the backups AND the restores.
I will however, attempt to make a server script to translate old backups into the new format, but I cannot guarantee that it'll work or even be ready by the time NRPTP releases.
Short answer: You should probably make your peace with that your characters will have to be re-entered after the upgrade.

Q: When is the upgrade being released?
A: When it's ready to take over for the LRPT. More planned features will be added post-release.

Will there be a new HUD?
A: Yes and no. The HUD is redone, but it uses almost exactly the same layouts as the LRPT HUD, with a different colour scheme. The new HUD also introduces a paging system that will play an important in the new module system. As always there will be a LITE version, but here's a preview of the unfinished normal version:





The HUDs will be hide-able at release =) And they'll be mostly optional, unless you want to make use of the future module system. The colour scheme isn't necessarily final yet either, it may change during the public testing phase.



Any other questions/comments/concerns? Feel free to voice them here or contact me in-game & I'll see if I can't give you an answer!

Ashtyn

  • Global Moderator
  • Super Poster
  • *****
  • Posts: 2664
    • View Profile
Re: The Future of The Lismore RP Tool!
« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2014, 06:42:49 am »
Looks promising, Tenaar!  :)