Cartoon Avatars

[Novaku]

Due to some complaints, and a discussion between us staff, we have decide to ask you, the player, your opinion about allowing cartoon based avatars to become legit characters. Now with cartoon based avatars I am referring to avatars heavily/completely based on the appearance of lets say, My Little Pony, Sonic the Hedgehog, even Looney Tunes. In other words, avatars that that basically copy down the appearance of well known cartoon characters.

While it is technically not against our rules persay, we the staff, admit that the appearance of, for example, a MLP pony, does really not fit well with our sim. But we feel that, because this is also a matter for you, the player, that we decided to make a public poll about it and get everyone's opinion/decision on it.

So please, by all means, vote your opinion so that we can make a final decision on this. We appreciate your vote and opinion.

[Raider Greymoon]

I voted I don't care cause it's not a yes or no question for me. This is difficult one for me, cause on one hand if done properly I could see certain cartoons working out. for instance "An ancient powerful wizard years ago created a powerful book and contained within its pages is one special page that could bring your drawing to life." obviously that's extremely simplified but I could almost see a well done MLP pony slipping through with that. on the other hand I don't see something like goofy or sonic the head hog fitting in at all and would probably actually disrupt the RPing greatly. and even the MLP one could disrupt if someone went all pinkie pie. You probably also wanna take into account that if you allow them with special cases you'll probably haft to do extra work with them to make sure it isn't going to be a problem.

In short I think in special cases they work.

[TheGreatBeatrix]

I voted NO because here's why:

1. Opening up characters to established franchises can create linked continuities
With the "MLP" example: If they exist, does their homeland? Where would it be in relation to Lismore? Would they be an established "race" in other places as well? What is their history? One could argue that "that can be applied to any character," to which I'd have to give the response that the bipedal humanoid with animalistic traits tends to be under the blanket of "furry," whereas "MLP" is not and should not be, while Sonic falls in the same category.

2. Character physiology
Cartoon characters are renown for not following conventional principals for their avatar. In Lismore it's been pretty simple: Animal-like avatar based on the human biped model. Unique features? Yes. Ears, tails, digitigrade feet, and other animal anatomy, but they are all generally on the same musculature and structure of humanoids. Cartoon characters don't require that, as referenced with the "MLP" example, they can be quadrupedal talking cartoon horses. Or sonic characters with gigantic heads and stick arms. How would these things logically exist in the same world that a human would? How would they have logically evolved to the point they're at? "BUT BEA!" I hear you ask, "THEY COULD BE MADE BY MAGIC!" To which I'd reply that if they can be created by magic, so could a giant pony-eating dickbeast. "WHAT THE HELL IS A DICKBEAST?" A race I just made up via magic.

3. You have no moral grounds with which to deny even more obscure characters
So, my little pony? Sonic characters? Where would it end? Would there be a limit? Can I play an oompah loompah? He-Man? He man had some pretty technological "magic" things, would those be canon too? Come to think of it, I've heard "my little pony" even had machines in their series. Sonic's primary antagonist was basically all about machines and robots. "BUT BEA! I hear you squeal, "THE MAGIC! THEY CAN BE WILLED INTO EXISTENCE WITHOUT ALL THAT STORY STUFF!" To which I would have to say DICKBEASTS. >8C

4. Copyright.
According to the LL ToS you aren't supposed to sell copyrighted material without the express consent of the IP's original owner. <- This right here is why we didn't have Sergal avatars until recently. Originally there was a sergal avatar in production by one Naoki Dengaku and in its initial trial run, the creator and IP owner of the sergal caught wind of it and said they would work to have it removed from SL permanently. In a fit of rage the one making the avatar complied by not selling it, but rather handing out the original sculpts full perms for free to anyone who asked. This was years ago and we didn't see a Sergal avatar until KZK cut a deal with their creator. I haven't done the research but I strongly doubt the creators and IP holders of MLP, nor Sonic Team/Sega, nor Mattel have anything to do with any of the SL variants of their intellectual properties. They are just kind enough/fat and lazy enough not to go on the hunt for it and wipe it from SL in a similar situation to the Sergal incident from before. So, by technicality, their very existence is possibly against the LL ToS.

5. Ruining player immersion
The idea of playing a role involves you getting into character, playing someone who is not really a digital copy of you but rather a character you manifest to play in a world or story. It's a little jarring when you suddenly find your fictional character in this unique world suddenly joined by Sonic the Hedgehog with Knuckles waddling up the wall beside you while he-man orders a milkshake from the bar and a "My Little Pony" is busy doing a jig at your feet and then A GIANT DICKBEAST COMES CRASHING THROU- you get the idea.

In conclusion: Vote yes for dickbeasts.

-Bea

[Tenaar Feiri]

I voted NO because here's why:

1. Opening up characters to established franchises can create linked continuities
With the "MLP" example: If they exist, does their homeland? Where would it be in relation to Lismore? Would they be an established "race" in other places as well? What is their history? One could argue that "that can be applied to any character," to which I'd have to give the response that the bipedal humanoid with animalistic traits tends to be under the blanket of "furry," whereas "MLP" is not and should not be, while Sonic falls in the same category.

2. Character physiology
Cartoon characters are renown for not following conventional principals for their avatar. In Lismore it's been pretty simple: Animal-like avatar based on the human biped model. Unique features? Yes. Ears, tails, digitigrade feet, and other animal anatomy, but they are all generally on the same musculature and structure of humanoids. Cartoon characters don't require that, as referenced with the "MLP" example, they can be quadrupedal talking cartoon horses. Or sonic characters with gigantic heads and stick arms. How would these things logically exist in the same world that a human would? How would they have logically evolved to the point they're at? "BUT BEA!" I hear you ask, "THEY COULD BE MADE BY MAGIC!" To which I'd reply that if they can be created by magic, so could a giant pony-eating dickbeast. "WHAT THE HELL IS A DICKBEAST?" A race I just made up via magic.

3. You have no moral grounds with which to deny even more obscure characters
So, my little pony? Sonic characters? Where would it end? Would there be a limit? Can I play an oompah loompah? He-Man? He man had some pretty technological "magic" things, would those be canon too? Come to think of it, I've heard "my little pony" even had machines in their series. Sonic's primary antagonist was basically all about machines and robots. "BUT BEA! I hear you squeal, "THE MAGIC! THEY CAN BE WILLED INTO EXISTENCE WITHOUT ALL THAT STORY STUFF!" To which I would have to say DICKBEASTS. >8C

4. Copyright.
According to the LL ToS you aren't supposed to sell copyrighted material without the express consent of the IP's original owner. <- This right here is why we didn't have Sergal avatars until recently. Originally there was a sergal avatar in production by one Naoki Dengaku and in its initial trial run, the creator and IP owner of the sergal caught wind of it and said they would work to have it removed from SL permanently. In a fit of rage the one making the avatar complied by not selling it, but rather handing out the original sculpts full perms for free to anyone who asked. This was years ago and we didn't see a Sergal avatar until KZK cut a deal with their creator. I haven't done the research but I strongly doubt the creators and IP holders of MLP, nor Sonic Team/Sega, nor Mattel have anything to do with any of the SL variants of their intellectual properties. They are just kind enough/fat and lazy enough not to go on the hunt for it and wipe it from SL in a similar situation to the Sergal incident from before. So, by technicality, their very existence is possibly against the LL ToS.

5. Ruining player immersion
The idea of playing a role involves you getting into character, playing someone who is not really a digital copy of you but rather a character you manifest to play in a world or story. It's a little jarring when you suddenly find your fictional character in this unique world suddenly joined by Sonic the Hedgehog with Knuckles waddling up the wall beside you while he-man orders a milkshake from the bar and a "My Little Pony" is busy doing a jig at your feet and then A GIANT DICKBEAST COMES CRASHING THROU- you get the idea.

In conclusion: Vote yes for dickbeasts.

-Bea

I love you.

[Lou]

I'm going to have to vote "no", and while other people have already given great points which I agree on, and some I didn't even think about, I'll just give one point that hasn't been given yet(I think. I'm still waking up).

With the inclusion of "cartoon characters" also would come, eventually, even worse clique problems. People who want to make characters solely to associate with these other cartoon characters, and while it might be good for the sim and group to have more members and more people RPing, the majority of non-event related, non-main-plotline RP would heavily suffer, because there's this group of people with characters from the same "origin" that interact with one another the whole time. Even if they welcomed other people to join them, the point is not for US to join THEM, and some people would be discouraged from entering an RP scene that is clearly being held between a tight-knit group of friends. This problem isn't restricted just to "cartoon character" groups, of course, but allowing "cartoon characters" would make this much worse, in my opinion.

In short, I'd rather have one of Bea's Dickbeasts walking around. That could provide some more entertaining RP to *everyone* at least. A chuckle or two.

[TheGreatBeatrix]

With the inclusion of "cartoon characters" also would come, eventually, even worse clique problems.

In an ideal world everyone would be able to get along with everyone else. In this case it's not so much a clique problem as a canyon-sized rift between players. Just because you can put two things together doesn't necessarily mean you should. People can like both pizza and milkshakes, but rarely do you ever find someone (that you'd want to associate with) who would like to combine their pizza with their milkshake. Two things that are okay on their own, but when combined make things kindof assy.

In the same vein, people can like their cartoon characters and go play them where appropriate. Just as we can play our furry characters where appropriate. I don't go to Gor sims trying to squeeze my fuzzy ass in their crowd, you know?

-Bea