Author Topic: What's required for a successful faction?  (Read 13724 times)

fawn

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What's required for a successful faction?
« on: July 30, 2011, 02:14:21 am »
In the history of Lismore we've had lots of factions, some of which thrive, some go up and down, others are more or less the same as they were to begin with. And some factions fail.

I just got to wondering: what's required to set up a successful faction?
Bamika Easterman

Xela

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #1 on: July 30, 2011, 02:40:56 am »
Active players, I'd say.

Husky Dragon

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2011, 02:45:00 am »
Purpose, active, dedicated players (It's not quite enough to be active, there must also be players who are dedicated to the faction), and a unique concept.

kenneth cale

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2011, 03:14:45 am »
active dedicated players i spose sums it up quite nicely. a unique concept is very helpful. the otters for instance were very unique but no one would play there because no one came up with a real story for them until most had left.
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Feame Yalin

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2011, 11:58:54 am »
AS Ken said.  Active, dedicated players are important, but not all that matters.  Need a purpose.  Such as the otters needed a purpose, a storyline, something to make them really take off, and go beyond what they ended up being....just seen as a temporary faction of lustful folks with otter avis.  You also need a leader of a faction that is known to be on frequently, preferably on the account that actually runs it, and is able to be gotten a hold of.  A faction with a leader who is impossible to get a hold of will not be very popular unless you are lucky as all heck.

Also, with the purpose, do not make it a purpose that is unpopular, or overall rubs the nerves of people.  The otter groups' 'purpose' was basically sex, and we saw what happened to them.  died out fast, and anyone who caught on to what was REALLY happening with the tribe came to have a distaste for them, or saw them as convenient sex objects.  this will not sit well with many players.  And won't sit well with any players I, personally, respect.  good purposes would be easy to see, such as the Zenko and protecting all of lismore, by standing guard over the portal.  The temple, showing peace and kindness, though not without a backbone.  They both have their flaws, and I think everyone could agree there is at least one aspect of both factions that they don't like, but the purpose over-rules any flaws, and allows them to be powerful, popular factions.  Well, that and it's not like we'd be rid of them, even if they where'nt, lol.

LadyUrsa

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #5 on: July 30, 2011, 06:02:07 pm »

Also, with the purpose, do not make it a purpose that is unpopular, or overall rubs the nerves of people.  The otter groups' 'purpose' was basically sex, and we saw what happened to them.  died out fast, and anyone who caught on to what was REALLY happening with the tribe came to have a distaste for them, or saw them as convenient sex objects.  this will not sit well with many players.  And won't sit well with any players I, personally, respect.

I would disagree with this one. It can be a good, stable faction that has an unpopular purpose, *if* there are good, dedicated players.  You might want to remember that what *you* think of as an unpopular purpose, might be quite well liked by others, and/or provide some fun and interesting dramatic role play.

There is nothing wrong with a faction that is free-wheeling, free-love, all sex all the time, but sex, on its own, is rarely purpose enough to keep your dedicated players for long.

The Temple, for instance, is open-minded about sex and love and sharing partners, even encouraging the odd orgy here and there, but it is only one part of what they are about. They have a complicated purpose, with many facets, and yes, many flaws, many of which were part of the original design. A good faction, with interlacing, complicated and intriuging plotlines, needs to have flaws, just like good characters.


The same things that make for good and interesting characters, make for good and interesting factions, whether or not the faction has a popular purpose. Just remember, if you have an annoying, or unpopular faction purpose or major plot, talk to the ECs oocly, be honest about the purpose's potential for conflict and then don't get too upset if the ic response to your demon slaver who kidnaps fawn to induct her into the rock and roll hall of fame, gets your faction/group in IC trouble.

Honestly, there was nothing at all wrong with the otter tribe growing into and then fading out as a faction, that should happen too. And there is nothing wrong with having many small factions that end up playing off each other and causing conflict with the larger ones.

Hell, some of us have an undersea "faction" we fool around with, because it's fun and we liked the idea of a political refugee intrigue plotline. It's not one that has grown into a major faction, and it may not, but that doesn't stop us from having fun playing with it.

Sometimes I think we all get too worried about the ranking of factions. Get together a group that wants to work out a plot line, double check issues with the EC's and maybe come talk to a staff member or one of the main faction leaders about how we can weave a response to your group into rp. Just remember, secrecy IC is good, is fun, OOC secrecy from ECs and Staff just makes us cranky and makes us less inclined to help you out. You don't want to invest in a big plot, only to have it retconned because you didn't check first.

Develop more factions that spring up, blossom and then die out, and more small groups in the major, pre-exisiting factions.  Zenko in particular would be a lovely breeding ground for political intrigue with their use of magic.  Lismore City could develop more of a light underclass or more of a noble class, and, while Tirrenelda is a Theocracy, with one leader and a Council of Elders, come and find ways to weave your story in with the tribe's and especially, talk to any of our Council of Elders OOCly about plot lines. Not all are staff, but we all talk to each other and chances are good one of the council will be talking to a staff member or EC that same day.
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Feame Yalin

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #6 on: August 02, 2011, 10:08:00 am »
Well, I do appreciate the long, and detailed response, Ursa.  And I find your input, to a degree, enlightening.  If not a touch of enough to throw me off.  Though, I might point out, one of the things is that I am not saying a tribal group, like what I thought the otters where supposed to be, is a bad thing.  Open to lustful things, not shy about their bodies, very native and natural about their lives.  A simple, quiet life.  Away from the countless rules of the Zenko, the troublemakers of each group, the conflict of interests in the temple among their members and some of their visitors, and so on.  Away from all the troubles.  This was a wonderful idea, in my opinion, and had it stuck....would have made for a really nice group.  but they lost, or where never really holding to the idea of, this wonderful idea, and became compelatly about sex.  And I feel sad for anyone who thinks that having every bit of your RP be sex is the only fun of it.  They clearly miss the point of a serious, or casual RP that don't need sex.  I do think sex has it's place in RP, and i honestly have admitted to many I wish more of it happend in my own RP's, though thanks to the rep of the otters, I've got at least one character I do my best to avoid allowing that to happen with.  If for no better reason than because I will not allow myself to gain the reputation that the rest of the tribe has earned themselves with their behavior.

That all said, I do have plans going with a staff member that may unfold in the long run to perhaps restore a sense of proper RP to the otters that have remained active [so far, as far as I know, this only consists of myself and erick] and hopefully revive the feel that was originally portrayed to me as the intention of the tribe.  so communication with staff isn't an issue.  and anytime I hold secrets from staff OOCly, btw, is generally because of old habits no thanks to old RPs I've been in.  Some of the reasons for said habits I've found to be present in one particular individual which I intend to see fixed.  which glad this topic came up, as that reminds me I need to contact someone about it.  But that's not the point of this discussion.

As for the flaws, I don't claim to know of a 'perfect' faction.  Or that any faction can be.  honestly, a faction without flaws would be rather dull.  nowhere for it to go.

Xela

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2011, 10:57:07 am »
Hmm... are people aware that phoenix has been in the making for at least 8 months now? Its takes no small time or effort to get a faction going D:

Feame Yalin

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2011, 11:07:45 am »
I know, Xela.  time is not a problem for me, though, as I have all the time in the world for this.  But it may take a little more effort as my actions are targetted to revive a dead faction.  Like it or not, folks, yes.....as far as it matters, the otter tribe may as well be dead, due to lack of active players, and the leaders beyond contact.

LadyUrsa

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2011, 01:46:12 pm »
Feame:  I did say above that any faction that becomes only about one thing is not likely to grow into something beyond that one purpose.  Now, this is not necessarily a bad thing, it could be that the players want just this one thing, and there is nothing wrong with that at all.

There was nothing wrong with the otters being about sex and free love and the like, it just meant that the faction was unlikely to grow too much unless they developed a side purpose.

I fully support anyone wanting to make a small group of like minded players that can do their own thing (within the sim rules, of course, and do check in with ECs), even if that purpose is nothing more than getting together for rp'd sex. Unless you are always walking in and interrupting others rp with your liasons (you being generic in this case), go screw around all you want with anyone you want, and have fun.  We are all, theoretically, consenting adults here, obey the sim rules and get your mack on. Hell, do it in the Temple huts or the common rooms, rent one of Svetlana's Inn rooms, that's what they are there for!

I do sometimes wonder why being an actively sexual rper is considered a bad thing. If it is the only thing you ever rp, people are likely to get bored with you, but there is nothing wrong with it.







“It is more fun to talk with someone who doesn't use long, difficult words but rather short, easy words like "What about lunch?"”

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Feame Yalin

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2011, 03:08:26 pm »
Well, Ursa, I admit I personally am against only sex as an RP, but I have my reasons.  While I do not have place to say someone can't do it, I've yet seen a valid reason to do so.

Mainly because I've RP'd most my life.  And the way I figure it, if you only want sex....well, go to a website devoted to it.  Sex is a lagit part of RP in a world like this one, but there are many whom just long on, have sex, log out.  Or worse, Log on when they know someone is seeking them for lagit reasons, and say screw any plans, because someone IM'd them saying they want sex.  This, in my opinion, is bad.  And nobody whom acts like this needs be put in any position of importance, ever.  Because if all they want is sex, let them have sex, away from those of us who want lagit RP.  I enjoy the things people take for granted.  The chatting in the temple, having a drink in the inn, and training and sparring at the Zenko.  RPing out rituals and things of the like.  The simple, fun, pg roleplaying.  Yes, I like the sexual aspect, and thus why I choose an RP like Lismore to RP in, but too many people [and 9/10 times it's the ones I complain about] have sex as a primary interest, and nothing else.  And oftentimes get pissy when it's responded to negotivly.  Especially oen person whom I will not name whom approached me ICly on my knight.  Basically blatently saying 'hi, we just met, and don't know eachother's names, but you want to have sex?', and then got pissy because my character, despite OOC interest due to the fact that particular character was playing on several of my kinks, told them to basically go screw themselves.  Come back when they are done being a prostitute.  THIS is what I have a problem with.  Sex?  yes, go for it, great idea.  Nothing but sex?  Yea, there are websites for that.  Let those of us who enjoy honest RP enjoy honest RP without you people taking the fun out of RP by just blatently trying to bone anything and anyone that moves [and, sometimes, things that don't.  Not the first time I've seen someone grinding their groin against the great tree.]. 

sorry, got on a tangent there, but I hope my point is clear.  It's not that I'm against sex, or even frequent sex.  I'm against doing nothing BUT sex.  Because we have enough slutty folks in Lismore whom you could sleep with just by walking up to and groping, we don't need more.  Less any concept of RP is burried under people seeing the sim, or any concept of RP, as a glorified sex sim.

Husky Dragon

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2011, 04:12:08 pm »
Well, Ursa, I admit I personally am against only sex as an RP, but I have my reasons.  While I do not have place to say someone can't do it, I've yet seen a valid reason to do so.

Mainly because I've RP'd most my life.  And the way I figure it, if you only want sex....well, go to a website devoted to it.  Sex is a lagit part of RP in a world like this one, but there are many whom just long on, have sex, log out.  Or worse, Log on when they know someone is seeking them for lagit reasons, and say screw any plans, because someone IM'd them saying they want sex.  This, in my opinion, is bad.  And nobody whom acts like this needs be put in any position of importance, ever.  Because if all they want is sex, let them have sex, away from those of us who want lagit RP.  I enjoy the things people take for granted.  The chatting in the temple, having a drink in the inn, and training and sparring at the Zenko.  RPing out rituals and things of the like.  The simple, fun, pg roleplaying.  Yes, I like the sexual aspect, and thus why I choose an RP like Lismore to RP in, but too many people [and 9/10 times it's the ones I complain about] have sex as a primary interest, and nothing else.  And oftentimes get pissy when it's responded to negotivly.  Especially oen person whom I will not name whom approached me ICly on my knight.  Basically blatently saying 'hi, we just met, and don't know eachother's names, but you want to have sex?', and then got pissy because my character, despite OOC interest due to the fact that particular character was playing on several of my kinks, told them to basically go screw themselves.  Come back when they are done being a prostitute.  THIS is what I have a problem with.  Sex?  yes, go for it, great idea.  Nothing but sex?  Yea, there are websites for that.  Let those of us who enjoy honest RP enjoy honest RP without you people taking the fun out of RP by just blatently trying to bone anything and anyone that moves [and, sometimes, things that don't.  Not the first time I've seen someone grinding their groin against the great tree.]. 

sorry, got on a tangent there, but I hope my point is clear.  It's not that I'm against sex, or even frequent sex.  I'm against doing nothing BUT sex.  Because we have enough slutty folks in Lismore whom you could sleep with just by walking up to and groping, we don't need more.  Less any concept of RP is burried under people seeing the sim, or any concept of RP, as a glorified sex sim.

Okay. The problem with your logic, is that roleplay means different things to different people. Some people are great roleplayers but only really want the sex. That's fine, and that does not, by any standards, depciriate their value as a roleplayer. The elitist excuse really doesn't apply here, because like you, many people on this sim have been roleplaying most of their lives. It's your responsibility to ignore or avoid roleplay of varieties you don't like. You're very right - You don't have a place to say someone can't do it, and you also have no right to take shots at their ability as a roleplayer for it. I suggest instead of complaining about it, you simply not make it pat of your roleplay agenda and, counter to what you've said, don't ruin other people's roleplay with your attitude, let them do whatever they want without having to worry about being judged by some disapproving shadow stalking in the background.

Ashtyn

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2011, 06:05:18 pm »
sorry, got on a tangent there, but I hope my point is clear.  It's not that I'm against sex, or even frequent sex.  I'm against doing nothing BUT sex.  Because we have enough slutty folks in Lismore whom you could sleep with just by walking up to and groping, we don't need more.  Less any concept of RP is burried under people seeing the sim, or any concept of RP, as a glorified sex sim.

Feame, I must ask that you watch your tone there.
You are entitled to your opinion as well as everybody else here, but you are taking it a little too far. It's one thing to say you don't like RP that is only sex. It's another thing to make the affirmation that we "have enough slutty folks in Lismore". That is generalized aggressive language that is not called for.

So please, back on to the topic of this thread.

Feame Yalin

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Re: What's required for a successful faction?
« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2011, 10:15:29 pm »
OK, first off, I'd like to apologize.  I got a little carried away there, and I admit I went a bit far.  Still think I had some valid points, but I'm not beyond admitting I got a little carried away and crossed the line.  So, to anyone bothered by it, I'm sorry.

And the point made by Husky, I never said someone 'couldn't' do something.  While I admit I was more than improperly harsh about how I said my pointers, I didn't say they 'couldn't'.  I just say I don't approve, and my personal feelings on the matter.  That said, don't worry....i'll be backing down.  I think my point was made very clear on my opinions.


....besides, a friend made me realize that my personal views may have been having an effect on my personal Roleplaying experience.  It's bad when I'm starting to mess up my own RP's with my biases.